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First Job: ways and means

本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛To get your first job, it's important to try every means possible and to apply for every position out there. Be thick skinned. Be persistent. Be like a mosquito in the Algonquin Park - never give up until you draw blood.

Lots of people get easily discouraged. They easily disqualify themselves. In my experience, very often jobs don't go to the most qualified person. I wrote before about a lady with no programming experience and no programming knowledge got a programming job. She defines the term "thick skinned". She went to many interviews. And the last one, the technical guy couldn't make it and the manager interviewed her. They had a great conversation and the lady was hired. A while ago, a Toronto bank was hiring a SAS programmer. They had to choose between a young man who's totally qualified and an older man who had many shortcomings. Yet they decided to give the position to the older guy because he's from China - same as the hiring manager. And they felt it's much easier for the young man to find a job. Too bad the older guy totally failed the written test later.

You never know why they choose one person over someone else. A guy I know totally disqualified himself even before the battle started. His reasoning? There're so many laid-off people out there with great experience. How can I compete? I told him often that there're many reasons a company could hire him instead of one of the laid-off workers. They probably will pay him a lot less. He's probably much easier to manage. He's likely to work harder. He'll probably stay in the position a lot longer. The manager might be his schoolmate. Or maybe he's simply more likable.

Besides responding to job postings, there're many other ways to find jobs. A woman found a job in architecture drawing through a church friend. A guy I know found his first job by cold calling 1-800 numbers. When he called the company which offered him the job, the old lady on the line said she knew a manager looking for someone. She put him through to the manager and he got a job a few days later. Try to get in touch with people in your field. It's a lot easier to get a job if someone you know referred you.

A very important channel for jobs is recruiting firms. The people there are often called recruiters, agents, or head-hunters. Many big companies hire contractors only through recruiters because of tax and legal issues. A lot of them hire full time staff through recruiters - I have no idea why. I got my first job (full time) in a tiny Toronto company through a recruiter. Years ago, I thought you use recruiters only after you have some work experience. Later I learned that a lot of people found their first job, mostly contracts, through recruiters.

Companies often deal with a select group of recruiters. Each manager often has his own favorites. It's important to get to know as many recruiters as possible. A project in a Toronto bank I worked on many years ago had about 20 people. Half of them came from one recruiter which had ties to the project manager. The other half came from two girls who were friends of the department manager. I wouldn't be surprised if the girls didn't have much beyond a company name. I got in because my boss knew a bigger boss there. A guy I worked with in the states were the architect of the group. The manager trusted him like a God. All programmers there were hired through his company which is probably nothing more than a name. These examples show the importance of networking. And to know the right recruiters who're often small or even tiny and could be even officeless and may never advertise.

The only thing the recruiters care is for the client to hire you. As long as the client likes you, they don't mind who you are. They don't care if you're a cheater, a wife beater, or an ugly fat toad. In my experience, you can be very open and informal with recruiters. I almost always tell them the truth. And try my best to be their "friends" - refer people to them, tell them inside stories of the company, teach them technical stuff, etc.

Recently, I read about a guy submitted by multiple recruiters to the same place. I don't know how this could have happened. In my experience, recruiters always call you before submitting you. In any case, never allow more than one recruiter submitting you to the same project. A lot of companies simply refuse to deal with you when this happens because of potential trouble. It's your responsibility to find out and keep track where you're submitted.

Never trust whatever a recruiter tells you. They're a salesperson at heart and they'll say anything to make a sale.

Don't bicker over the pay of your first job. Grab whatever is offered to you. I would even take a minimum wage. It's the hardest to find the first job. After some local experience, you'll be in driver's seat and can ask whatever the market rate is. If your current employer refuses to pay up, you can always leave. You're in so much stronger position when you already have a job. When I got my first job many years ago, my pay was at least 20% below market. A mere 4 years later, my pay was probably 30% over market. In the same company.

To summarize: get to know as many people as possible; try different ways, even crazy ways; apply to all the jobs you deem appropriate; use recruiters, they're very important to first time job seekers, maybe even the most important.更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
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  • 工作学习 / 事业与工作 / First Job: ways and means
    • good stuff.
    • Excellent stuff. 难得的热心肠的toad。新移民必读之一。佩服!顶!
    • 不错,这真的是论坛的精华。
      • 受益非浅啊! 多谢你对文章.
    • +1
    • 同意. 为了找口饭吃, 是得不择手段.
    • I agree with "You never know why they choose one person over someone else." This aligned with my job seeking experience.
    • In terms of recruiter, is there an optimal number of them to work with? Or one should work with as many as possible - under the assumption that one can track who is working on what company?
      • I'd say to work with as many as possible. IMO, they always call you before submitting your resume so there's no issue of keeping track. Pay special attention to the small ones ...
        本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛I believe many recruiters are essentially one-man operations. Most of them work for the one and only client they deal with either on the technical side (programming, architect, database, etc) or on the business side (analyst). As a result, they have a great relationship with the client. Once they send you to the client, unless you're really bad, you're hired.

        I believe the girls in the Toronto bank I mentioned fall into this category. Very likely they didn't advertise. And they probably got all the people through referrals.

        The guy I worked for in the states probably never advertised either. He got candidates through referrals. How did he find me? Through another one-man-operation recruiter. This guy is a programmer but he also worked as an agent. He advertised in internet newsgroups (probably tor.jobs) - not sure anyone is still using them now. That's how I found him. Since we had similar background - working in the states but living in Toronto - we had lunch together a couple of times. And he referred me to that guy who eventually hired me.

        IMO, these small recruiters are gold mines. It's not easy to find them, though.

        Seems to me that recruiting is a relationship business. You never know which recruiter is a good friend of which manager. I went through quite a few contracts in the states - each through a different recruiter. Each time I felt the recruiter was very close to the project manager. This is why I believe one should work with as many of them as possible.更多精彩文章及讨论,请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
        • Thanks for the reasoning. One-man recruiter shop is more like the middleman between a job seeker and the employer, this makes sense.
    • good stuff. -richsettler(PC);
    • Good article. “very often jobs don't go to the most qualified person。“ This is definitely true. For the manager, especially those in big companies, it is more important to find a suitable person who can fit in a team well,
      than to find a one with more expertise, which can be developed in the future.
    • very good advice from an insider.
    • good advice
    • 佩服楼上所有读完这个文章的人!我只看了一行,我是真想看,不过英文不好太辛苦。
      • 老猫的英文还是很不错的,读着非常舒服,地道。
        • 多谢夸奖。前一段有人说我中文不好。呵呵。
          • 那是拐着弯儿夸你.
      • 9494
      • 9494
      • lol i read backwards..it might be readable if lz uses more common language anyway not bad